58. Escape the Career Trap: A Career Change Roadmap From Tammy Alvarez

PATRICIA: Tammy, welcome back! I'm so excited to have you on the show again. 
TAMMY: Thanks for the invite. And the opportunity to reach out to your audience again. So thanks again.

PATRICIA: There's, as you know, a very special reason why you're here. And one that I'm very excited about. You have a new book and it came out literally a day before we are recording. So tell us about your new book.

TAMMY: Yes. So I'm so excited that the book is called Escaping the Career Trap. Transform your apathy into ambition and never hate Mondays again. This book has been six years in the making in terms of in my head and my coaching practice and with my career experience. I started writing it about nine months ago, so we had a pretty fast turnaround time in terms of getting it out there to the market. And it is designed and built and written for anyone who feels like they're stuck in the soul-crushing grind. For anyone who gets that pit in their stomach on Sunday afternoon, because of all of the silliness that they're getting ready to face again for another week. And so if you don't wake up energized on Monday mornings, excited about what you do, you need to read the book.

PATRICIA: Yes. I mean, even if, even if you like what you do, you're going to find yourself in that spot at some point and you want to have already the tools in your toolbox. Right.

TAMMY: I agree. It is really for all the career professionals. Right. And, and how to always have that thriving career. And in the book, we talk about these five lies. But I think one of the biggest lies that we don't even know is untrue is the fact that loving Mondays is not a pipe dream. Loving your job isn't some mythical concept that no one actually does. Because most people are like, work is work. And I'm not supposed to love it, so I just have to suck it up and just get her done. And it's actually not true. And so you know that's kind of the premise that all of our coaching and and the book and everything else really starts with is stepping into something that energizes you that you love that you're passionate about. Where you're making a big impact, and you know, and the work that you do, you know that you do matters. And so that's why I'm just so excited because our coaching practices dealt with this for years with hundreds of clients. And now with this book, we're able to reach so many more people in a much more accessible way to really start to, you know, empower people to make that transformation for themselves.

PATRICIA: Oh, I absolutely love that. And part of the reason why I was so excited to start on this recording is because I've spoken to so many people, um, some who we end up coaching together and some who are like, you know, it's, I'm not in a place where I can afford this. Right. And so no matter where you are on the spectrum, whether you're the CEO or the person who is at their first position, um, this gives you, it's like a career manual. that you wish you got at onboarding at nearly every single place that you went. And the reason why you're not giving this manual, I think, I'm gonna own this, right? I think the reason you're not giving it is because there's this worry that if you know how to navigate the career space, then you may not be at XYZ position, kind of like a significant other who's like, I'm gonna put you down so you don't know how, you know, so you know how great you have it with me kind of thing. But the reality is that we have options everywhere. And if we just know how to navigate these options, if we get out of our own head and stop putting barriers on ourselves, we'll be able to pretty much have any opportunity that we want in due time. So Tammy, I would love to hear from you in all your vast experience, what you think are some of the top mindsets that are holding us back in our career in jobs that we just don't like.

TAMMY: Yeah, and it was interesting, because earlier in my practice, we were going to have our sixth birthday on Valentine's Day. So it's right around the corner. And when I was trying to understand how my clients felt and how my potential clients felt, and just really trying to understand what's going on in that head. I know it was going out of mine, because I've had various degrees of loving what I do and hating what I do. And one of the words just surprised me, because it kept coming up. And to your point, whether it was the CEO of a major organization, high-level, mid-level, or individual contributor, it was just really interesting. The one word that kept showing up was stuck. I feel stuck. And I'm like, huh, that's not what I expected to hear at all. There were so many other things that I thought would come through. And the biggest reason that we feel stuck is because we feel like we don't have control. And we feel like there's so many other forces at work and we've got to, you know, stay in our lane, be patient, do the thing. And that we're, you know, our skills are finite and they can only be used in a certain area. And so all of these misperceptions lead to us not taking the action that we need to get unstuck. And I think, um, you know, during the launch party yesterday, we talked about two, I think, big mindset shifts that people need to make. Right. One. is the idea of, you know, success and failure and really how we have an unhealthy relationship with success and failure. And so we look at failure and success as opposites. But the reality is you can't succeed unless you fail. So if you avoid failure, you are avoiding success. And so if you stop putting yourself into these cage matches of do or die situations, right, wrong, yes, no, black, white, and you move into more of an experimental mindset, realizing that absolutely nothing in your life is a complete success, and nothing in your life is a complete failure. There's always a mix of both, and you control that narrative. So if you have this experimental mindset saying, OK, I'm going to get some things right, and I'm going to screw some things up. And then once you have a chance to recap, you're like, I'm going to keep the things that worked. I'm going to not do the things that punch me in the face again, because that wasn't super fun. And I'm going to try something different. And when you do that, all of a sudden, you have this ability to appear fearless. You have this ability to take these risks that you thought were impossible five minutes ago. And when you start taking those risks, and when you start to really lean into impact and value, instead of obligations and I've been here long enough, I deserve this, then the whole game changes, right? So I think that's one of the biggest mindset shifts is that you really do need to get comfortable with failing forward. Take that experimental mindset shift and start to play a little bit and stop taking things so seriously. The second big mindset shift that comes in with feeling stuck is feeling like you just don't have options. I was like, I've been doing this for a while. How am I going to compete against somebody who's done something differently for 10 years? And how am I going to win that? How am I going to compete over that? And when we think about making a change, because what we do no longer serves us, and it no longer energizes us, we immediately move into a scarcity mindset. And we talked about the fear of change. And my strong opinion is that I don't believe people fear change. People fear loss. If you were going to win the lottery tomorrow and $70 million is going to end up in your bank account, I'm pretty sure you're not going to be afraid of that. But the minute we think, let's change something. This isn't working for me. It's like, oh, hang on a second. I'm going to make less money. I'm going to have to start all over again. I'm not going to have the impact. I'm not, I'm not, I'm not. And nothing in your life has ever been an abject failure. So why do you think this is going to be the case this time? And so getting out of that scarcity mindset, realizing that, you know, they're not monsters under your bed, they're actually just dust bunnies. So if you look, they're a lot less scary than if you don't look, you know, will really help you identify where am I energized? You know, what are the things that light me up that I could do for 12 hours a day and never get tired? Because if you do more of those things, then you will have the thriving career that you want. And if you always check in to see, cause they change, right? Mine has changed over the years and everyone else's will too, to make sure you're still running the right race, then you'll always step into that thriving career.

PATRICIA: I love it. So in these mindsets that you're sharing, some of the underlying pieces that I heard are basically, I mean, if we were to sum this up, essentially you're saying, we kind of feel overwhelmed by the thoughts in our head and everything that's going on. And it's really, it sounds like three big things, failure, loss, and energy management, right? Like there's three things. And I think oftentimes we walk around all day long with all these thoughts in our mind that because we don't have a structure to put it into and a way to define it, objectify it and say, hey, we're looking at it from the backside, but you can turn it around, right? It's something different on the other side. It changes everything. So our perception of the problem changes everything. It's now no longer a problem. Now it's an opportunity. Yeah. So I really like how you bring these up. Um, okay. So, so let's say someone's listening and they're thinking, Oh shoot, she's talking straight to me. Right. What now? What do we do to get back in alignment, to get back into a position where we love what we do every day?

TAMMY: Yeah. Other than by the book, right? So we'll go over there first and then we'll step one by the book transformation guide, which is your support material. Okay. So now that that shameless plug is over, um, you know, I think one of the more important things to realize is, um, you have way more control than you think you do. And the very first part of the book, there's four parts in the book, and the very first part of the book, which is reveal, and I talk about the dynamics behind the dysfunction. Because although there's well-intended actions everywhere, I don't think anybody's coming from a place of bad intent. However, the employer-employee relationship has never been more screwed up. And I have, I mean, and it's getting worse. Absolutely. And so if you play by the rules, you are going to get stuck and stay stuck. But when you realize, like, this is the playing field we're on. Nobody intended it to be this screwed up, but it is. And here's what I need to do differently to not just survive, but thrive despite the dysfunction and put the fun back into dysfunction because you can. Then all of a sudden, all these gating factors that seem to be blockers are now just speed bumps, right? And now it's not just a wall you're banging your head and it's of course, it's this way. Here's what I do instead. And that's really where the first part of the book helps you get very clear on what is broken. It's not going to get better. So let's not hope is not a strategy. Right. So let's just know that it's not going to get better. This is how we're going to have to play and how to do it successfully. So that way you thrive and not get fired in terms of breaking rules and getting out of the soul crushing grind and, you know, really getting comfortable with that failure and change mindset. Now, all of a sudden, you know, it's just a different game you're playing. Absolutely. So personally.

PATRICIA: There you go, right there. I just had a conversation with someone who was, brief synopsis, right? They had gotten a job offer, but it wasn't for two or three months that they started. They had another potential offer and they were like, well, I don't want to be disloyal. And they were treating the organization as a person they have a relationship with. And part of the conversation is organizations don't treat you in that same way. And so we're treating our careers as a person to be loyal to. When we can actually separate the two, we can have a relationship with the person and still do a business transaction, because that's what we are to an employer, for better or for worse. That's just what it is, right? And so I think part of your, like, revealing the dynamics behind the dysfunction involve partially a dysfunction that there is in the hiring, you know, mechanisms of hiring and AI.

TAMMY: It's hiring, it's interviewing, it's promoting, it's all the things, right? Everything is broken. And us, we are too. Like the way we behave. Because we're trying to live in this dysfunctional system and it doesn't serve us or the company, right? I mean, Gallup survey for the past 10 years has shown employee engagement or disengagement at 70%. So basically 70% of the workforce doesn't care. Yeah.

PATRICIA: And we're treating it as if it does. We're playing by completely different rules that no one else is following. And so I love how you're breaking all the rules with this.

TAMMY: Yeah. And we do talk about escaping that loyalty trap. And the reality is, when we start to treat our career like a business, and you become that CEO of you, Inc. So Patricia, Inc., and Tammy, Inc., and everything else, our careers are the business. And now we're the CEO, you make different decisions. Right. So when you start to do that and you start to realize, because when you think about it, it's not personal. When you think about how your company chooses a supplier, buys paperclips and everything in between its highest value, which is highest quality for the least amount of money. It's not always the cheapest. It's not always the best. It's that value for money equation. And that is how they hire. And so if they're hiring you, and it's totally fair, it's how they stay in business. And you know, it's how they make money and continue to be profitable so you can keep having a job. And so when you realize that this is just how businesses function, and you also take a business mindset, realizing that you're exchanging your services, knowledge, and expertise for compensation, vacation time, a cool 401k, and maybe some other perks, but it is a commercial arrangement. And that doesn't mean, and I think where people get hung up is they think that if I do this, all of a sudden, like, I'm not going to have rewarding relationships with my coworkers. And I'm not going to seem as loyal to the company, or I'm not going to have that full experience of belonging to somewhere. And actually, I found it to be quite the opposite. Because now when you have that business mindset, you realize you're just trading goods and services for money and compensation. You know, you take the personal out of it. And you show up differently and you make better decisions. And the lens that you look at is not only better for you and your career, but better for the company and their growth and their success. So everyone wins when you do this. And so I think that's where a lot of people get stuck in terms of really feeling that personal connection. Because especially in America, we connect a lot of what we do with who we are as a person. And so when you've got that one way relationship, you're like that clingy girlfriend where the guy doesn't really care about you, right? Because you're like, Oh, I care about you so much. It's like, yeah, glad you're here and moving on. Right. So, um, so you don't want to be that clingy girlfriend. And so when you start to have that business mindset, then all of a sudden the, I think that the relationship comes into balance and your perspective comes into focus in terms of not overthinking this and not taking things too personally.

PATRICIA: It's emotional intelligence. It's really kind of having the boundaries. And like you said, when you have those boundaries, now you can show up in a different way. Now you can see people for people instead of seeing people for the business decisions that they have had to make. And I agree, your relationships are overall better and your performance is better. I love it. Yeah. Okay. So we kind of got into the dynamics behind the dysfunction, by the way, this is chapters one through five, part one, if you need to read it, but let's hop into, um, sort of the nitty gritty of like the other three steps. Right. So as far as aligning, what do you have to kind of share with us as like an initial first step to think about?

TAMMY: Okay. Um, and so, yeah, so the other four, the other three parts are align, disrupt, and thrive, just so listeners know kind of where we're taking you on this journey. And from an alignment perspective, I think we look at our career and what we do through all the wrong lenses. And that's why we end up feeling stuck and cranky and all those other things. And so we focus on what have we been educated on? What are we expected to do by friends, family, neighbors, keeping up with the Joneses? What's going to make the most money? What is the sexiest route for me to take in terms of being marketable in the future? And all those things. But at the end of the day, they're all well-intended, but that's not really where you need to focus in terms of your alignment. And what you need to do is you need to align with the things that light you up. You need to play to your strengths. How many times you're like, yeah, yeah, I'm good at that, but I suck at this. So I'm going to spend a lot of time trying to get average at something I'm not good at. And that is the worst idea ever. It's like you, you play to your strengths, you strengthen your strengths and you find mitigating strategies for the things that you suck at. Because if you're not good at it by now, I got bad news for you. You're never going to be. And so find other ways to get the same things done by people who love doing that because it is their strength and everybody will win. And so that alignment is really taking a very introspective look at what lights you up, what are your superpowers, and really starting to create that vision and strategy for yourself. And I use an analogy in the book because a lot of times we actually don't create a strategy. We have an accidental career.

PATRICIA: I know I did. I had no plans, right?

TAMMY: I showed up, I got my first job and everything else took care of itself after that, right? I got fired twice, promoted a bazillion times. I had all the things. And so, but it was all accidental. Like nothing was done with purpose. You have things that come to you, you either take it or you don't, and then you move on. And, and so there's no shame in that, but you shouldn't be doing that. And when I talk about having your, you know, strategy, your vision and your execution for your career, What I talk about is I, you know, provide an analogy, basically, to a five-hour road trip. You know, so you decide you're going to go away for a long weekend, either at the beach or mountains or wherever you love, and it's a five-hour drive away. So you're like, that's where I want to go next weekend. That's your strategy. And now you have to decide how you're going to get there. Are you going to take toll roads and get there fast? Are you going to take back roads? Do you want to stop at a few destination points along the way? That might be interesting. Right. I'm sorry. The vision is your direction. That's your strategy is how you're going to get there. And you decide what are you going to do? Right. So your vision is that beach or mountains place. The strategy is I'm taking the long route. I'm not in a hurry. There's some really fun things to see. So that is that is how I'm going to get there. That's my strategy. Then the next thing you do and the last thing you do is you get in the car and you drive. But then what happens? Google Maps or whatever you use pops up and says, hey, there's construction. Do you want to take a different route? Now, do you turn around and go home? No. You decide, oh, no, I'm just going to sit here because it's not that bad. And I really want to see that point, or I'm going to take a different way. And that's execution. And so with our career, it's the same way. You need to set that vision of where do you want to be? And I don't recommend doing anything more than three years out. Things are too dynamic and changing. You need to figure out, so that's your vision, your strategy, which road are you going to take? How are you going to get there? And then when your phone says, oh, you're screwed because you've got a six hour road delay ahead, you don't go home. You don't quit. You don't park on the side of the road and cry. You say, yes, take me a new way. And you still get there. And so I wish more people had that level of intentionality with their career, particularly on the execution part, because that's usually where the, you know, where all the excitement happens.

PATRICIA: You know, that's as soon as you said the execution part, you talked about that. And all I thought was nearly anywhere that you go right now is bound to have a detour, an accident, something. And in life, we see as, oh, you just go around it. Right. When we talk about things like our career, in particular, our career, it feels like a hit to ourselves, to our ego. And because it's a hit to our ego, we just stop. And it's like, well, if it were my ego, I wouldn't want to stop at the failure. I want to keep going till I win, right? Like, isn't that the perspective we're trying to take is to keep going with new tools and toolbox.

TAMMY: Yeah. And there's a really interesting analogy that I heard from Dean Graziosi about resilience. And You know, he talks about the fact that, you know, and I agree, I don't think we lack resilience. What I think is that we lack certainty because if you knew that you had to take a detour 37 times to get where you wanted to go, you would do that because you knew that on the 38th time you'd get there, you have certainty, but we don't have that certainty. So we don't know when, how many times we're going to have to take a detour. And because we don't know too often, we turn around and drive the car home right before that next big win. Because we think we're not going to get there. Yeah. Right. And you don't know, it's like, do I have 17 more of these to do? Is it never going to happen or is it the next time? And so, you know, I think it's less about resilience and more about certainty, but realizing that whenever you are at that point of quitting and saying, I give up, this isn't what I'm meant to do. I'm going to have to just think about something different. Nine times out of 10, that next push is going to get you where you want to go.

PATRICIA: Okay, I love it. So there are so many people who are I'm sure listening right now that are in the middle of their career transition, or life transition, whatever it might be. And they're just thinking, you know, this isn't working. Like you said, I'm going to turn back around, right? At this point, I feel like I've gotten far enough along, maybe not that far, but far enough along. in my life to recognize that if I have a goal, I will reach it. It might not be today. It might not be next year. It might not be for five years. My timeline may be different, but if that's what I decide that I'm going to do outside of a fatal accident or something crazy, right, I'm going to eventually reach it. And I think it's that perseverance and that grittiness, right, that I think, um, can just, you know, you, you pair that with the, with that like certainty, that's how you move forward.

TAMMY: Well, and I also think, um, it's important to, can you, oh, sorry about that. Let's try and speak English this time. Um, it's important to really continue to check in with your goals because we set them and then forget that. And then all of a sudden we hit the finish line and we've been running the wrong race for years. Right. And so to realize that our goals are fluid. Yeah. And that, you know, to check in and make sure, I mean, COVID was a big reset for a lot of people, right. In terms of running the race and, you know, just the daily grind and then like, there's actually life out there. Like I can actually have fun and I like my family and I like walking off to work or whatever. And so, you know, but continue to check in because two things, make sure you're running the right race. Right. Cause when you're starting to lose that stamina, maybe it's because Your goals have shifted and you've not given yourself that acknowledgement, you know. And then the second thing I think is to really lean in on your purpose. And we talked about getting to that level seven why, which is from Simon Sinek. And I have found that such a huge motivator for me because I set big goals. I take big risks and I fail often. And again, success and failure, so nothing is ever, you know, but I definitely have my share of bruises, you know, from swinging and missing more often than not. But the one thing that kept me going is I got really, really clear on my level seven why. You know, quick backstory, you know, when I was growing up, we were, you know, middle-class, felt great, everything was good, private schools, mom stayed home, all the things. Long story short, my parents split up, My dad leaves town, can't find him anywhere, and we're homeless when I was 15. So taxes hadn't been paid in 10 years, house was being foreclosed on, the whole nine. And so seeing what my mother went through, because she got pregnant with me in high school. And so she was ill-equipped for all the things, because she was always a stay-at-home mom. And she supported my dad's business, but that was it. So she was ill-equipped to deal with two children, me and my sister, and being bounced on the street. You know, so we couch surf with relatives and friends and it was a hot mess. I mean, it was hard for me as a selfish 15 year old, you know how girls are at 15, you know, and seeing my sister four years younger than me, but seeing what my mother went through and just, just the, the, the stress and the panic and, and just, you know, not being equipped to handle what life throws at you. Um, I knew right then and there, I'm like, that will never be me. And that hyper drive to not ever be in that situation. is what really that fear beast, it was definitely a fear-based motivator for sure, but that is what made me play bigger. And that's what made me, you know, be able to take all those risks. And that's what kept me going when I was failing. That's what kept me trying one more time because, you know, then that morphed into, okay, now I don't want to be a burden on my daughter. Right. My parents had no money. We supported them, you know, unfortunately, you know, we've lost them both, you know, but we supported them, my sister and I, you know, because they had no money. I never wanted to be like that with my daughter. And so when I started this business, it was the same thing. You leave this big Wall Street job, big money, big everything else with all this uncertainty. I'm like, I do not want to have to be sleeping on my daughter's couch when I'm retired. And so that was all the things that kept me going. So when things get hard, make sure you're running the right race. And you need to connect with that sense of purpose that makes you thrive. Because when you do that, you develop a level of determination that even you don't know you have. And that's where the grip.

PATRICIA: Yeah. That's like the. That core motivator, we're as humans, we're driven by emotion more than logic, no matter how logical we are, that's just part of our human nature. And to find that emotional driver is it's like. having it, I mean, to be crass, it's like having a source of income that you can pull on anytime because now your motivation, right. Is driven by something larger than the reward, the external reward that's there. And so now that just comes, um, just because you love what you do. Yeah. Okay.

TAMMY: And that's how you learn, right. Is checking in with your goals, making sure that you've got your why and, you know, finding that, that opportunity to make sure that you stay resilient.

PATRICIA: Okay. All right, so let's say we get through the alignment phase, and I know we're going long, so let me know if we need to at any point. I'm fine with that. Then let's keep going. So now my favorite part, disrupt, breaking all the rules. Tell us about breaking all the rules. That's right. How do we break the rules without breaking the rule?

TAMMY: You break the rules without getting fired by breaking the rules. Right. And so, and there's all these things that we believe to be true that aren't. And so when you start to realize and it's things like I'm going to have to take a step back if I make a change, you know, things like people won't hire from outside their industry so I'm really kind of stuck where I am. you know, underselling and undermining the level of value that all of your skills, experiences and talents up to this point can drive in a new role in a new way. You know, and so from that perspective, when you start to decompose some of those or deconstruct some of those things and really embrace the fact that the rules apply to other people and exceptions are made every single day. And when you really start to strengthen the things in terms of treating your career like a business that we talked about, really understanding the value of all the skills that you've developed over the years and not dismiss them as I haven't done them in a while. I'm not an expert. Somebody else actually did the work. We give away our skills all the time, not realizing that that's actually the currency you're going to use to buy your next job. So saying that, oh, I didn't actually do that work is the same thing as saying, oh, well, I didn't actually work for the interest on my investment account, so I don't want it. It doesn't count. It's the same mindset, right? So if you look at your skills as money and that money is going to buy your next opportunity, you start to take credit for a lot more things than you would normally. And then playing to your strengths that we talked about and really starting to focus on that power base. You know, when people will make that movement for you, you know, job boards are dead. They're a good place of research, but you're not going to get a job there. It is going to be your network and your power base that does that for you. So do not discount it. And if, you know, for the, cause everybody sucks at networking, everybody hates the word networking. So that's fair. So we're going to call power base instead. And what I mean by that is when you start to look at people who can actually make an impact in your life and career, and you become that person who can make an impact for others, you know, through, you know, making a few phone calls and giving some advice or whatever it takes, then you start to build this community. And Porter Gale, who is a professional speaker and networking expert, has a really amazing saying. And what they say is, your network is your net worth. And it is true. If you have stronger networks, make more money, full stop. So if you look at everybody that you've got in your network as a strong relationship and know that that's going to be good for $1,000 a year on your bank account for the next 10 years, you would start to look at things much differently. And so breaking these rules are you know, stop doing the things or not doing the things that you're doing and realize that you can step into that thriving career when you start to address things differently and you show up differently. And you realize that the human nature, which we talk about a lot, Patricia, is that thing most people want over everything else. There's only one thing people want. And that one thing is, are you the person to get me what I want? Like we are ultimately self-serving, right? And so we ask all these questions, we do all these things, you know, but at the end of the day, if you are the person that is the bridge between, you know, anybody you're working with, where they are and where they want to be in terms of success, and you show yourself as that bridge, you will win every time. So much more to dig into. This is one of our biggest chapters in terms of parts of the book, but that's a good sneak preview.

PATRICIA: Yes. And part of the thing that I always talk about is like the that we have, people perceive us a certain way. We have a reputation, whether we want to admit it or not. And part of what you do in breaking all the rules is you show people almost step-by-step, like you really show people how you can brand yourself. And I know that might not be a term that resonates with professionals. And so really it's how you can communicate your value. That's what I hear a lot. How do I communicate my value? Well, you communicate first by owning it. That's number one that you talked about. And then you communicate it also by recognizing that your skills have value. They're not just something you've done. There's something that you now have in your toolbox that you can solve a company problem with, that you can move a bottom line with. And if you're able to communicate it in those terms, now you've got a money-making machine, and that is your brand and your reputation. So I love how you do that in part three of the book. Okay. So we break all the rules, right? Now what? Yes.

TAMMY: Now it's time to thrive, right? The hard work is done. And once you get in the habit of breaking the rules, then you're going to realize you're never going to play small again. And that's when you really, really start to own being that CEO of your career. Again, when you think about what a CEO does, right, they need to make sure that they've got competitive market positioning, right? That they've got products and services that everybody wants. So they've got a rockstar sales team. you know, and all of these things. So if you start to think of your career like a business, and how do you run a successful business and do that for yourself? Boom, I mean, that's when everything changes. And so and when you start to do that, then you move into a position of having the ability to help others and bring others along. And I think that's really one of the biggest things is, you know, getting comfortable with your authentic leadership style, so you can lead your way because now you're the CEO. No one can tell you what to do. You're the boss of you, so you do the thing. And then realizing that during times of chaos, which when hasn't there been chaos, right, in terms of years. And so that's when there's such a leadership gap, and that's when leaders are needed the most. And so you can step in and become that leader that people choose to follow, regardless of hierarchy or what the organizational chart says. You know, you have the opportunity to pave the way for others. So you've mastered all of this stuff. Don't keep it to yourself. Like show others how to do this and build this unstoppable force in terms of people around you. And then when you do this on a consistent basis, then you are going to find that you're going to step into a life that's vibrant. That's well balanced. And then all of a sudden Mondays, you know, are something that you love again, instead of dread.

PATRICIA: Absolutely love that. So I like how you mentioned thriving during times of chaos. And it really resonates with this concept like, you know, you hear of economic downturns, right? And if you're a business, as we're talking about, you know, thinking of your career in terms of a business, if you're a business, down times, economic downturns are the best time for opportunity. It means there's a need, there's a problem, there's a gap to be filled, just like you mentioned, right? Where there's chaos, you need leadership, right? And so, I mean, we could go down this rabbit hole, which we won't for the sake of time. But, you know, this whole idea of artificial intelligence is causing so many layoffs. Guess what? You immediately have the one skill that if you have the skill, it becomes an opportunity. What was the reason for your layoff is now the reason why you get hired everywhere else. So start thinking about, What are some kind of downturns or spaces where you think you have a setback and take the time to be present, to slow down, to think about it strategically, don't just react, but kind of take the initiative to decide how can this work to my advantage instead of to my detriment? And so I really like how you brought that.

TAMMY: Yeah, because when everyone else is hiding under their desks hoping not to get fired, that is the perfect time to surge. But make sure that you're aligned with the organization's priorities. That's, I think, the big caveat. So when you decide that I'm going to take some risks, I'm going to lead from the front, a lot of times people are scurrying around and there's this frenetic energy. but nothing is actually getting done, or the wrong things are getting done. And so make sure that you know what the two biggest priorities of the organization are during times of chaos, and use that as your North Star. Because if what you're doing doesn't deliver against one or both of those, don't do it. Because now you're running around crazy like everybody else. So that requires you to have a lot of perspective. on where the organization is prioritizing to batten down the hatches or to take advantage of an opportunity that some of this instability creates. But if you align to those and can quantifiably deliver to those, swing big every time.

PATRICIA: Yeah, I like that. So align yourself to the priorities of the organization. And of course, make sure that's aligned with your values as well. And you almost can't go wrong, like you said, right? With every failure comes a success. I love that. All right. Okay. I, you and I could keep talking for, I don't even know.

TAMMY: And we went way over, so I'm sorry.

PATRICIA: Not sorry. Yeah. Sorry. Not sorry. Trust me. It was worth every minute that we had this conversation. I know it's helping a ton of people. Um, but I know that now folks are like, okay, how do we get this book? Cause I need to read it. I need to work with Tammy. I need to figure this out. Right. Um, how do we get the book? Where can we find you?

TAMMY: Great. OK, so there's two primary places you can get the book. My strongest recommendation is hit the EscapingTheCareerTrap.com website, because when you get there, you're going to get a hardcover of the book. You're going to get tons of free downloads of things that are going to help you move faster that no one else has access to. And you're going to get discounts to our transformation guide. Now, most coaching books have their standard transformation guide, which is like a spiral round thing, a spiral bound thing with like static worksheets. Well, you know, we don't play that way. And so what this does is this allows you to have an online version to grow on the go. So basically, it's your digital Sherpa. At the end of each chapter of the book, I have some brain candy for you. And these are things I want you to think about after reading the chapter on how you can apply it to your specific situation. And so I encourage you to do that and journal those. But if you really want to move your insights into action, you need to take the next step. And that's what that transformation guide is there for. You can get it other ways, but if you want a discount on the monthly subscription to have access to this great material, get the hardcover, get the discount, and grow like crazy. Obviously, you can also get this on Amazon. Who doesn't buy books on Amazon anymore? So you can get the softcover, the e-book, and the audiobook through Audible on Amazon. So hardcover, freebies, discounts, escapingthecareertrap.com, go there first. But if you want to just date and not get married, then head to Amazon and grab either the audio, e-book, or softcover.

PATRICIA: Awesome. Thank you so, so, so much. Um, I know that there's, so we've got like the hardcover, we've got the Amazon. We're going to put those links in the description. Um, are there any, no, I won't say, are there any, tell us, tell us some final words that we should walk away with as this episode ends.

TAMMY: Hope is not a strategy. You have more control than you think you do. And as soon as you start to step into your power, everything will change.

PATRICIA: So get on that, get on that. I love it. Thank you so much for spending time with us today. I really appreciate your insights.

TAMMY: This was so much fun. And thanks again for the invite back. I really, really appreciate it.

PATRICIA: Absolutely. Thank you everyone for sticking around with us. Know that we love you. We're praying for you. We'll see you on the next one.