75. Networking From Zero to a Community of Professionals w/Stephen Morris

Patricia Ortega: [00:00:00] Hey friends, welcome back. We are with Stephen of Renowned Leadership once again, because he always brings us really good topics. And today we're going to be talking about networking because Stephen is a master networker. And so it's gonna be a fun conversation. Hey, Stephen.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: I don't know if I would say master networker.

Patricia Ortega: I don't know. I think you're doing pretty great.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: I mean it's funny. Like I was talking to a friend of mine last night and there's a group of us and someone brought up duck dynasty. I'm like, “Hey, you know, that's Chris's BFFs cause he's friends with all those duck dynasty guys.”

Right. So when I think of myself, I'm not quite there yet because I can't call the Robinsons, my BFFs. So, yeah. Networking is super important and I had to get good at it. I wouldn't say I'm a master though.

Patricia Ortega: Well, I think you're doing pretty great.

And I always think [00:01:00] that there's always going to be someone better than you. But that's actually the person you want to look to in that skill. And I think you're just this great, you have this like way that it's not about a tactic or a strategy. You just build a relationship without almost even thinking about it.

And as a complete, introvert, I work at that skill quite a bit actually. And I have clients who will be like, okay, we're getting into networking. What do I say? And we literally script it out because I know the pain of like, I don't know what to say to move this forward. And so once we learn that skill, it becomes more and more natural.

 But you just do it. So first, there's a reason—

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Can I- Can I interrupt you real quick?

Patricia Ortega: Yeah.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Because I have a great tip for people like you.

Patricia Ortega: Oh, tell me. Let's get started. Tell me.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Find people like me and make me your friend. And you call me up and you're like, “Hey, Stephen, I got this event. I need you to be my wingman.”

Yeah. I have zero problem walking [00:02:00] up to a group of people. I can walk into a group of doctors. I'm not freaking doctor. I don't know anything about being a doctor, but I can carry on a conversation with them. Right. I have zero problem doing that. So find extreme extroverts, and get them to go introduce you.

And I've literally done that before where I'll just walk into a group of people and be like, “Hey, how y'all doing? My name's Stephen, what are we talking about?”

Interject myself into the conversation, talk to them for five, 10 minutes and be like, “Oh, Hey, this is my friend, Patricia. She's like right in your niche.” Then gradually project you into the conversation. And then I dip and I go get some buffalo wings or whatever's on the buffet, right?

Patricia Ortega: Job done. Check, check.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: But I mean, it seriously works.

Patricia Ortega: And for a lot of folks, introvert or not, I think personality style sometimes is not as clear cut, it's not as dry as people say. Those personality assessments, I only give so much weight to them. But when you're in that situation, a lot of times it actually has less [00:03:00] to do with your ability to talk and more to do with the fact that you're really good at starting the conversation.

There's folks that are really good at the one on one, like once I make a connection with someone, you know, we've had so many conversations, right? I can go on and on and on. It's that first point of contact. I'm like, what am I going to say? Right? And we all kind of have that to some extent.

And so let me backtrack a little bit here. There's a reason why we decided this was a great topic for today's podcast. I remember. Yeah, I remember you saying you were like, Oh, you know, I had no network when I started. So tell us about that. Yeah.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Yeah. If you've heard my other podcasts that I've done with you to the listeners… Y'all have heard me talk about the army and I was in the army for 16 years, real long time.

When I got out of the army, I had no network that wasn't in the army or in the military or something to do in that sphere. And so obviously I don't do that anymore. And I realized real quick, [00:04:00] like, man, I know nobody, I have no friends, like this sucks. And so I just started finding people that I wanted to be like.

Or people that I thought could benefit me by sharing their wisdom and knowledge with me and I just started trying to make them my friends. And I think the reason I cringe is because when things are scripted, you can always tell.

And my next piece of advice even if you're introverted, is just be genuine. People don't care as long as you're genuine, but if you come up to me with a script, I'm, what are you trying to say?

Patricia Ortega: Let me back up here. Let me back up here. So when I see a script, we sometimes need a framework. We need an example to be like, how does this look like?

Like you said, check, find someone that you want to be like, or whose skills you want to grow. You need some sort of a model, something to work off. Now, do you go and read your script to someone? Absolutely not. But now you can [00:05:00] see with your eyes, the beginning of the conversation, the flow of the conversation.

Basically, what we're doing is we're studying people like you, Stephen. We're figuring out how does he do it? Let's break it down. Because not all of us are as naturally gifted as Stephen Morris in this area.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: You know what absolutely ticks me off. So, you know, my wife, Katie, she is a painfully introverted person like you.

And I think I've told you this story actually, but I don't know if I've told your listeners. So we were at this event in Cincinnati. And we were staying at this Airbnb. The host of this Airbnb ended up being some really awesome people. And they invited us when we got back from the event they saw us get back and they invited us to have tea on their back deck, beautiful, beautiful setting, beautiful back deck.

They live in a 250 year old house. Like it is beautiful. So we're like, yeah, sure. So we go down and we have to start having tea with these people. And we hang out for three and a half hours and I'm just [00:06:00] schmoozing it up, doing me. My wife says maybe two, three words the entire time. And usually it's whenever they ask her a direct question.

And then she looks at me to finish answering her question for her. And so like I said, we hang out for three and a half hours. We get up to leave because it's late and we got to be up early in the night and the next morning. So we get up to leave. And they look at me and like, “Stephen it's nice to meet you.”

Shake my hand. And they look at my wife and they go, “Katie, I just love you so much.” And I'm sitting here like looking at her, looking at them, looking at her. I'm like, yo, I just spent three and a half hours working my butt off. And you love her? What? And so it's just all it makes me so mad. Anyway, my point is, if you're introverted, you don't even have to be the speaker in the conversation, right?

Because what do [00:07:00] we lack severely? And in society today, that's listening, right? We don't have listening skills. What do introverts naturally have? The ability to listen. That is such a unique gift that when people experience that? A lot of times they're going to instantly be drawn to you. Just because you hear them.

We want to, we crave to be heard, man. It is deep, the passion we have to be heard. And all Katie's done is I've taught her to just show that she's listening by repeating what they say.

So you're telling me that you're an introvert, Patricia? Yes, Stephen. That's what I'm telling you.

And then you carry, you continue the conversation. Just paraphrase what they say back to them and then let them keep talking and keep listening. People freaking love that. And if you do that, man, there you go. You got a friend for life. And you're gaining the wisdom, you're getting the connection, [00:08:00] whatever, and they're always going to remember you.

That's the girl that listened to me. I've bared my soul. I shared my life story with this person because they listened to me. So my point, use your natural given skill to help you rather than feel like you have to talk. Yes, you do have to do the awkward part of going up to the conversation. I get it.

That sucks. But as far as actually talking, you don't have to do it. Just listen, just actively listen, and people are going to love you.

Patricia Ortega: There's a book. I think it's like this, the power of the introvert. I'll link in the description. I got to find the title.

It's a great book, it talks about that strength in the introvert, because it is a two way conversation. And I don't know if you can break down your genius. So we're going to try.

Cause there's so many different ways of doing this. What is your style of creating that contact, but also nurturing that contact to eventually, whether it's get a job, become a client, partner [00:09:00] with you, et cetera.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: So my favorite way is to do stuff for people for free, because when you do things for people, they feel like they owe you. It doesn't have to be a complex thing, I've been told this is manipulative. I don't think it's manipulative, I think it's just me understanding psychology. But just doing something simple for somebody, they feel almost like they owe you.

And so whenever I reach out to my network and, “Hey, I lost two clients last month, I need to fill those slots. If you know anybody send them to me,” they almost feel obligated to do so. That's my favorite trick is just, I do stuff for people. First, I talked to them, I get them to like me and then I was like, “Hey, how can I help you?”

A lot of times they're going to be like, “Eh, I don't know. I'm good.” No, man, dig deep, show them you care. Dig deep. Like, “No, seriously, how can I help you? What do you need?” And then you do it for free. Most [00:10:00] of the time for free. Then when it comes to pay me back, it's, “Hey, I need some clients.”

I need some referrals. You were a great example. I just build a relationship with you. I'm like, “Hey, you know my style. I need testimonials cause I don't have any yet. Can you give me one?” And then boom.

Patricia Ortega: I was happy to.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Exactly. You just get people to like you, you do stuff for 'em.

Then when you need something, you go ask them. I don't know. it sounds natural to me.

Patricia Ortega: I really like, because you are a natural at this. It's a unconscious competence. You're like, I just do it. I don't know how I just do it right. But I really like studying people's unconscious competence.

 So I really like studying it because I think from that you can get frameworks that maybe aren't even in textbooks. But in this particular case, I enjoy seeing your process and what you're saying is, networking is long term, right?

It's not just, I need a job. Let me go out there and network. No, no, no. This is building a community around you that kind of shatter proofs [00:11:00] your future, not just yours, but also the communities, right? There's a lot of, in the Latino culture in, a community-based culture. It's very much.

We rise together. And we fall when we're by ourselves.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Yeah, that's a straight psychology because we are born, we are built to be in community. We aren't meant to be lone wolves. And that's one of the funny things about introverts because people like, Oh, I'm introverted. That means I need to be alone.

No, that's not what that means at all.

That just means being in large groups drains your energy. I get energized by being in large groups. I have fun being in large groups. You don't like it. It's awkward to you. It drains your energy. That's all that means. That doesn't mean you don't need a community. You don't need a network.

 I think the stereotype of what an introvert and extrovert and what's a myth in the middle omnivert? No, no.

Patricia Ortega: [00:12:00] Ambivert. Ambivert. I think they call it.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Ambivert. Something like that. Anyway, it's not about those things. It's about just how you gain and receive energy. So, I mean, understanding that first and foremost.

And then it's not, I don't think I was born with this skill. I think I just had to develop it. So I did. I won't use the actual term, but resting blank face. That was my persona when I left the army. Like I just looked ticked off all the time, never smiled.

Like I carried myself, like I'll beat you down at the drop of a hat. That was how I was taught to project my energy in the army. Right. So that's why I say, I don't think it's necessarily natural to me because I had to learn to get rid of that.

Because it made people scared of me and learn to project like this open warm energy.

And then the other thing that I learned to do is my strength is [00:13:00] not listening. My strength is talking. So how do I get people to be interested in talking to me? So we all have if that's the road you need to go down, you have a story, you have something interesting that's happened to you in your life somewhere.

Maybe you were five years old. Maybe you were 30 years old. I don't know. But somewhere along the lines, you had something happen to you. And usually, it's kind of traumatic. That's okay. You got to get over that. Like usually what's happened to you as a strength. That's what I do. I can walk up into a group and be like, huh, that's interesting.

I got shot three times and then just leave it. And then everybody will just kind of, and? And so that gives me total permission just to talk about myself and let them learn about me. So I mean, what is your strength? Find your strength. If your strength is listening, use that.

If your strength is talking, that's great. Find a way to get people to give you permission to talk. [00:14:00] And I think that's where we screw up a lot of times in networking. I would say the first biggest mistake we make is that we go in looking for something in return. If you need a job and so you start networking because you need a job, it's already too late.

That ship's already sailed. That's not going to help. I could be totally wrong, but in my opinion, you should have network long before you needed a job.

Patricia Ortega: You're absolutely So, you mentioned three different things. The first one, I think you and I are in the same soapbox on this one, personality assessments are only reflective of what you put into it. And they're very much dichotomous.

You're either this or you're this. Now, no matter how much, when we do the interpretations individual or group, no matter how much I tell you, it's just a preference. It's this and that. Every single person that I have talked to looks at the assessment results as if they are a identifier of their very own true self.

 Sometimes I'm like, [00:15:00] I can't even deal with assessments, right? I can't, because if it calls me an introvert, how long am I going to be like, oh, I can't network because I'm an introvert? No, it just means it's not a natural skill. But we all have to learn skills that aren't natural.

And you'd be surprised because you are quote unquote introverted. Like you said, it means you get your energy from deeper relationships. That is the whole point of networking. But most of what we see is the beginning, the introduction that is not networking. Networking is a depth that happens outside of the event.

Well after you've had that first conversation.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: And I just want to add to why. The personality assessments are, in my opinion, total BS because you can never take human bias out of it. I see myself as a hero, not saying that I do just an example. I see myself as a hero.

I always run to people's aid when they need it. So I'm going to answer everything in the [00:16:00] personality assessment that paints me that way. Because that's how I see myself. But just because I see myself that way, doesn't necessarily mean it's true.

Patricia Ortega: It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Exactly. So if you see yourself as painfully introverted, that's how you're going to answer the questions.

If you see yourself as. lazy and lethargic. That's how you're going to answer the questions. But that doesn't necessarily mean that your actual personality, that's just how societies told you or branded you or whatever. Like personality is so much more than the Myers Briggs.

It can describe certain features and aspects. I'm not saying they're useless, but like you said, when we take them as the Bible, they're absolutely destructive because then it traps us into this idea of this is who I am and this is how I have to act. Simon Sinek. is a painfully introverted human being and he speaks to [00:17:00] millions.

Steve Jobs is a painfully or was a painfully introverted human being and he revolutionized the world.

Patricia Ortega: Those are just some examples. Oh, tell me about Einstein. Cause Einstein, he was not painfully introverted. He was literally the most extreme definition of.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Yes, he was. Dude could solve for everything, but he couldn't tie his own frickin’ shoes.

Einstein, he was just so introverted, but he, he changed everything. And it wasn't because of, you know, the introvertedness wasn't a roadblock is my point. He still did what he had to do.

Patricia Ortega: Yeah.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: You know, Simon Sinek still goes out and does what he has to do. He understands his calling.

He embraces it. That means he's got to speak in front of thousands of people on a stage. He goes and does that. Have you ever seen him coach somebody live on stage? It's insane.

Patricia Ortega: Is it?

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Yeah, it's so cool. Just thinking of [00:18:00] me doing that. I think I'm a great coach, by the way, but just thinking of coaching someone in live in front of thousands of other people.

That is freaking terrifying, bro. Like the cojones it takes to do that. Seriously, and he's an introvert. He describes himself as painfully introverted. it doesn't stop. You can't tell me that you can't network because you're an introvert. When I see introverts doing all these amazing things, literally changing the world.

Patricia Ortega: Yeah, no, it's absolutely, I'm gonna say this last point on, on personality assessments, but then I'm going to get off the soapbox. We're going to move on to the different ones, but. You said it, you named all these people who are successful, despite the quote unquote introversion piece, right.

A, it's actually a strength, but B outside of that completely. This is the reason why I get on my soapbox about assessments as much as yes I do them, yes I interpret them right, but when you take an assessment, you have a perception about who you are, you have a perception about your limitations, that perception, like you said, that [00:19:00] bias goes into the assessment.

That leads to the results. And the only thing the assessment is doing in many cases is actually validating and further sinking you into your belief about yourself. And most of us will look more to our limitations than we will to our strengths. And that's the reason why I'm like, I'd rather dream, envision, create, as opposed to throw my perceptions into a tool that's just going to reflect back the same thing.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Absolutely. And I love that you bring up the being an introvert is actually a strength because my strength is actually kind of a weakness when you think about it societally, because what gets on people's nerves, people that don't shut up, what's my strength? Not shutting up.

Patricia Ortega: There's a flip side to every strength and every quote unquote weakness, right?

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Right. So I had to figure out a way to make it my strength. And like I said, I just. Go inject something that is going to catch a hook [00:20:00] into a conversation to get people to give me permission to talk. Because as long as they give me permission to talk, I'm not going to get on their nerves. But then we perceive introverts as being introverted as a weakness and I'm guilty of that.

But it's actually a strength because like I've already said, what do people love? People that actually hear them and listen to them. So you naturally have a strength that I can't even begin to comprehend. It even gets on my nerves, like the level that you or my wife or other introverts possess the ability to listen.

Oh my God, it's annoying. But it's just annoying because it's not my strength. And I want that strength, but it's okay. I've found a way to manipulate my weakness into a strength.

Just like as an introvert, Simon Sinek, all the introverts we talked about, they have found a way to manipulate their perceived weakness into a strength.

So it's all about perception. I agree. And these tests, they just trap [00:21:00] us into what we already think. And that's never a good place to be. We never want to be put in a box.

Patricia Ortega: I think this concept of permission to talk seems to be what keeps coming up. And this is what for me makes all the difference in the world. I'm a person of systems and so I'm always how do we build that into our system, not to recreate it without thinking, but just to make it a part of who we are, make it a natural habit, right?

And one of the pieces that I've come across working with clients is showing people how to get that permission to talk is really powerful because most of us feel the pressure to speak and say something eloquently, correct, grab their attention, but it's actually not. if I'm in a conversation with you, it's not actually that hard for me to get you to talk and invest. And like you said, it's back and forth. So once I ask about you, I invest in you, I listen to you, which is that strength naturally you are then going to reciprocate and you are going to [00:22:00] say, well, what about you? What do you do?

That's your permission to talk. Then at the end you ask, well, what do you think? So it's like a game of tennis. You're just hitting the ball back and forth. And that permission to talk is our strength, is our ability to get the permission to talk by giving attention. I listening well, and then waiting for them to reciprocate.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Yeah, absolutely. And there's a bunch of different ways to get permission to talk and likewise. When I talk about me telling people, okay, so you're an introvert get permission to listen as well. And so that's why you're repeating or paraphrasing back to them.

That's a key tactic and active listening, obviously, but you're showing them I'm listening to you, I'm invested in you, I'm invested into you. And that's continuing to give them that permission to talk, which, like you said, it's a game of tennis. So it's giving you permission to keep listening.

And so whenever they, okay, so tell me about yourself. What do you do? Now [00:23:00] it's shifting back over to you. But again, Oh yeah, I do this, this, this, and this. I got into this because of X, Y, and Z. How did you get into what you do? And then you answer their question.

You give them a good, thoughtful, thorough answer, and you flip it right back around and give them permission to talk again, it's just communication. And the more I've learned and dove into networking and learned about communication, all this stuff, the more I realized we aren't taught to communicate at all.

Ever, unless you're a communications major. And even then I'm probably guessing 99. 9 percent of your curriculum isn't actually about communicating.

Patricia Ortega: It's outward communication, but not inward, not listening, not two sides of that coin.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Right. So, and without listening, there is no communication. think the most important thing anyone can do is develop the skill to listen. And unfortunately, it just doesn't come naturally. [00:24:00] I just want to talk, talk, talk, which does benefit me. And podcasts, not a strength at all in coaching, but I mean, a lot of what I do is a strength. But I really need to define and build my ability to listen. I'm pretty, help me, Patricia.

Patricia Ortega: I think you do pretty well. And this is probably a good thought to start to wrap things up. It's like, okay, I don't have this skill of listening. And the reality is you do, it's just not as full of a bucket as your speaking skill is. So you pull on that. And in your coaching appointments, I know your coaching style. And so I know that in order for you to be able to speak, you want to be able to listen enough to then have something relevant to share in that conversation. And so when we think of a weakness, I would encourage all of us, including myself, not to think of it as something you don't have.

You don't have means zero. It means you have nothing, but you have [00:25:00] it. It's just not what you have most of. So we have to remember the glass is half full and most often, a glass half full is enough to get us through the day.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Absolutely. And after I said that I was thinking about it, I actually get complimented on my podcast a lot of times on my ability to actually listen to my guests because I do the exact same thing you do.

There's no script. There is an idea of a topic and that's what we're gonna talk about. We might get on a soapbox and go complete 180. You never know. And doing that, you do have to actively listen to your guests because otherwise the conversation is going to fall flat.

And so, I do possess the ability. It's just, it's unnatural to me. So I have to force myself to do it. For introverts, being around large groups of people is so energy drainings because they have to force themselves to interject themselves in the conversations, it's not natural.

So because it's not natural, it zaps your energy from you. [00:26:00] Like you said, wrapping up the most important piece of advice I could give is just truly learn who you are. What your communication style is and how you fill your buckets. If you fill your buckets by talking, figure out how to use that as a strength, not as a weakness, if your ability is to listen, then find a way to use it rather than make it be a detriment.

I promise like we could go to a networking event and I could show you like how listening is just as powerful as speaking in a large group of people. It's all about the questions you ask.

Patricia Ortega: Yeah, absolutely. And in my head, I'm already thinking of another topic we could talk about because you talked about learning, and being willing to learn.

And even if it's your strength, if you are, Oh man, I could talk to anybody and everybody. That's great. That's a strength. But now how do you leverage it? So whether it's a strength or if it's a weakness, you have to put the intention to leverage it well. [00:27:00] There's a quote that says something like, the worst time in the economy is the best opportunity. And I think that's true of every negative thing of every weakness.

There's a way that you can ride the wave. So how do you make your life smoother by leveraging your strengths and also your weaknesses?

Stephen Jarvis Morris: You're doing great. And that's such a great analogy. I've never thought of that. But it doesn't, it blows a lot of people's mind. Like if they don't know anything about investing in the market? When the market sucks, that's the best time to dump your money, go buy, go crazy because the market's inevitably going to go back up.

And that's how we make money. But a lot of people don't think of it that way. They think of a booming market as when everybody wants to invest. And that's not the case. That's such a great analogy. Use the downturns, use that as your leverage. Perfect analogy. I think you did a great job.

Patricia Ortega: Well, thank you. Thank you very much. Um, it's always great talking to you, Stephen. Every time we come up with some [00:28:00] new perspectives, information, tips, strategies. So thank you again for coming on.

Stephen Jarvis Morris: Yeah, absolutely. Always my pleasure. I hope it was valuable.

Patricia Ortega: It really was. It really was. And everyone, thank you so much for listening.

Know that we love you. We're praying for you and we'll see you on the next one.